| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Newt
USA
657 Posts |
 Posted - 12/04/2002 : 08:20:37
|
KILE, Our north slope oil is going to Japan because of the sulpher content, the knee jerks don,t want to use it in this country because it would polute. Now we get it back on the trade winds and jet stream. Ask your dad who brokered that deal. I know, and that is one Owl I got no use for.
Another debate item, why didn't the knee jerks jump on the railroad situation. We blew away trillions on roads and meanwhile the maintenance costs are sky high. The freight liners are congesting the roads and the rails are rusting. One train can move about 400 times more than an 18 wheeler. Austrailia is going the same route, and there may be a reason, its either a lobby or maybe the unions. I assume it is both. They could have federalized the rail beds and charged the rolling stock a fee, I don't like the idea of the feds taking control of anything but it would have been better than letting the system go down the tubes. Every time I see one of those recaps on the highway, I call alligators, I think about the risk this lack of concern has created.
I guess my partiality is showing, I do like trains and think they have a place in the scheme of things. If they had kept them upgraded, who knows what advances they could have made.
Think of the recaps on tankers and vehicles hauling chemicals, long haul, and if the truckers were not doing a heck of a job we could be in deep trouble. So I find no fault with the truckers, however, we left the gate down with NAFTA.
What does this have to do with politics? Its what the politicians do
that gets us in trouble, not what they don't do. I think someone has their prioritys screwed up. We cannot have a one world system, we are different and like it that way. I could care less how other countries choose to run their governments. They do it with the permission of the people and if the people don't have the backbone to take control thats their choice. The people floating over here for freedom are not worthy of ours, if they are not willing to make a stand in their own country.
The libertarians have the most favorable platform, do away with the waste and put the responsibility back on the individual. We didn't become a great nation depending on the government, we are the government. This dependency on Washington has got to stop somewhere or we will become a third world beggar. Canada and Austrailia are in the boat with us, all the people I talk to on ham radio in those countries see the same thing happening. You can blame it on our birth control.
We are being out populated by the government dependants.
|
 |
|
|
olderthendirt
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 09:04:56
|
| Let's review first we have all liberals in league with satan (not the hockey player in Buffelo) Then liberals do not recognize the differnece between opinions that are facts (conservative) and opinions that are fallicies (any opinion that disagrees with George B) and now we find that all liberal drink and party instead of working hard. We probably break into the homes of the innocent weathy, do drugs, and abuse our families in our spare time when we aren't out stopping innocent loggers from cutting down the last of the old growth forrests. At least we don't think children working in mines would give them a career. Goota admitt you conservatives have a sence of humour, how else could you make some of the comments you do! |
|
|
|
KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 10:52:37
|
| Mark, no one said all liberals are in league with Satan (Just the Clintons, Daschle, Gore and a few key leaders) most are just misguided. I also didn't say that my oppinions are facts, they are based on facts and liberals tend to base their opinions of feelings, not facts. As far as children working in mines, it was said tongue in cheek. You didn't answer the question, which is better growing up in a mine with the potential of a collapse or growing up in a government owned slum with the potential of being killed in a drive by or over a drug deal? Which form of opression was better? Like I said at least the kid that grew up in the coal mine will get some marketable skills out of it. |
|
|
|
olderthendirt
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 11:32:55
|
| First neither kid has much chance of growing up. I have stated neither your extreme nor your perceived liberal extreme serves the great unwashed body politic. Unions were a creation of unchecked captitalisic greed. Suggested reading, Double Star by Robert Heinlien. He understood how politics should work and rarely does. Funny how I see your opinions are based on feeling and mine are based on fact. |
|
|
|
KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 11:37:10
|
Explain to me which ones of my opinions are based on feelings?
As far as unions go, they are socialistic and anti-capitalist and bad for this country. When agree to work for a company it is a contract between me and the company, if I hire someone it is a contract between me and the employee, unions are no better than Jesse Jackson, sticking there nose in where they don't belong and always asking for a handout. Both take their living out of the pockets of the working man. |
Edited by - KileAnderson on 12/04/2002 11:39:26 |
|
|
|
CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 11:54:02
|
I tried to get in last night, but lost my typed post again, just about the time the new forum format was likely being entered.
Anyway, yes Mark, our Tar Sands are full of black gold. However, extraction production costs are much higher than traditional drilling costs per barrel, so when WOP are low they back off a bit and lean on the proverbial shovel which in this case is the size of a 3 storey apartment building. Western Canada is still feeling the damage caused to their entreprenurial visions that were caused by P.E.T. (Trudeau for short), with the infamous part of his legacy that was the hated National Energy Policy. There is an enormous amount of oil and gas in the ground yet, that has been mapped but not scratched for yet and it is all over North America. It is the politics of self interest groups, their lobbyists and their financiers, that is preventing this production from happening. We each will pay a dear price for this delay, and in more tangible ways than just dollars, as reliance on foreign production becomes increasingly less reliable.
Jim's mention in another post of GW's current battle cry, ".... are you with us or against us ....", makes me think past the immediate issues of Iraq and North Korea, and consider the sleeper - Saudi Arabia. More and more news seems to come out each week and be confirmed that the Saudi's are playing with both ends of the dynamite stick. If the Big Fella slaps their wrist for their indiscretions he may cause the Abdul of Oil to go pout in the corner and turn off their taps.
I found some startling information sourced from the U.S. Energy Information Agency. "In 2001, the USA imported 9.32 MILLION BARRELS OF CRUDE OIL PER DAY. The top 5 suppliers of crude to the US in 2001 were, in total millions of barrels;
1. Saudi Arabia 588.0
2. Mexico 508.7
3. Canada 494.8
4. Venezuela 471.2
5. Nigeria 307.1 (end of quote)
Truly astounding, with what you have in the ground, to have to import 9.32 Million BPD x 365
Nigeria is no great bed of political stability and peace either.
On first blush, it's not clear who should be the next star on your flag. From an american point of view, both Mexico and Canada have beneficial "things" that they bring to the table that are of value, quite different from each other; but likewise each has baggage (quite different from each other) but still baggage that would not make assimilation easy.
In Newt's last post, his last two sentences drive to the root of a problem that is damaging our socieities and that has long been an increasing burden to our economies - immigration, both naturalized and the tire tube refugees.
Now first, I recognize and I hope all recognize, that our countries grew and prospered due to immigration, mostly in the first half of the last century. Cann't imagine what the expanse of our frontiers would still be like without the migration that occurred back then to North America. Millions of people came to our countries, called it home, made it home, worked hard and prospered - and "we" are the result of that.
However, in the last 20 years, whether it has been 1%, 5%, or 10% of the immigration that has occurred - people have arrived with a different expectation. They seem to have grasped at the opposite message that JFK gave (I think it was during his inauguration), and they stand there and demand what the country can do for them, and not what they can do for their country - and themselves.
It just burns me how we can continually allow this migrating flock of uselessness into our countries, while on the same day and every day in far too many back streets of our communities there are hungry children, because their parents can not find work (and some are earnestly looking for work).
At the same time, my mailbox and likely your mailbox, has on a weekly basis some colorful plea to help the disadvantaged in a country far away and hard to find on my globe. For every 5 or 6 of these pleas, I might get one looking for some of my money to help a homeland social inequity. Then, when one reviews that "charity", you find they are just another "big business" with a shiny veneer face, in that only .25 to .30 cents per dollar raised gets directed to actual "do good" resources.
Our legislators at all levels of government are being stroked, guided and manipulated by self interest groups, their lobbyists and their powerful financiers.
"We", the people, in either country, no longer in reality "are the government", and our voices are now a mere whisper regarding our thoughts on any actual change or stance. |
|
|
|
olderthendirt
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 13:51:34
|
On alighter note and I won't speculate on which party would be in power as both are capable of this.
Once upon a time the government had a vast scrap yard in the middle of
the
tundra.
Government said, "someone may steal from it at night." So they created
a
night watchman position and hired a person for the job.
Then Government said, "How does the watchman do his job without
instruction?" So they created a planning department and hired two
people,
one person to write the instructions, and one person to do time
studies.
Then Government said, "How will we know the night watchman is doing the
tasks correctly?" So they created a Quality Control department and
hired
two people. One to do the studies and one to write the reports.
Then Government said, "How are these people going to get paid?" So they
created the following positions, a time keeper, and a payroll officer,
then
hired two people.
Then Government said, "Who will be accountable for all of these
people?" So
they created an administrative section and hired three people, an
Administrative Officer, Assistant Administrative Officer, and a
Legal Secretary.
Then Government said, "We have had this command in operation for one
year
and we are $18,000 over budget, we must cutback overall cost."
So they laid off the night watchman.
An a note to Kile I have never defended unions BUT they were created by coporate greed and now we have to live with them. We create our own monsters. Also I find that I can not find your facts, because they are opinions. ie Gore, Tom D etc are evil, sorry that is an opinion not a fact (except to legions of Rushimanics).
|
|
|
|
KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 15:34:58
|
| I'll grant you that one, Mark. It is my OPINION that Gore, Daschle, the Clintons and Barbara Streisand are evil, but that opinion is based on the things they say and do, which are facts. |
|
|
|
olderthendirt
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 15:37:14
|
| Your opinion on their actions is fact only to a Rushimanic. |
|
|
|
KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 16:22:14
|
| Mark, I listen to Rush's program when I am driving and it is on. I am not a "Rushimanic". I know how to think for myself. |
|
|
|
Janice Toll
USA
40 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 17:01:59
|
| Just a reminder or observation, the Topic is "Almost Anything", NOT "Anything Goes". I am neither liberal nor conservative, but INDIVIDUAL. I was given a brain in order to think and do not need a political party to tell me how to think. |
Janice R. Martin-Toll |
|
|
|
olderthendirt
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 18:01:45
|
| Rush loves to marginalize those does doesn't approve off (femanazi etc), when you maginalize a group and the members of it, then that is a personal attack. That is not opinion that is fact. So we know that both extremes are capable of personal attacks. |
|
|
|
KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 18:09:06
|
| How is maginalizing a GROUP a PERSONAL attack? That makes no sense. You're really stretching it now. |
|
|
|
olderthendirt
USA
370 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 18:15:52
|
| You certinly took it personally when I marginalized you as a Rushimanic. As would a woman speaking up for equal pay for equal work when refered to as a fwmanazi, or someone who worries about un checked pollution when called a tree hugger. But I reaaly don't expect understanding from the gunhuggers out there. |
|
|
|
Gale
USA
231 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2002 : 18:47:24
|
| Maybe we should each write a book and call it, "I am OK and you are not OK" :( |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
Partisan Politics
Forum Locked
Topic Locked
