Forums



Recent Posts

Sean Peck asked the question Bermuda

4 days ago

Pondmanreplied to: RE: CougarPaws vs. Felt Waders

Don't forget the $2.98 bungee cord. 

1 week ago

Pondmanreplied to: RE: CougarPaws vs. Felt Waders

Not sure, but why don't you make a pair, climb a two story 12/12 pitch and do an analyses between the two.
Oh, and I'm sure you might win $100,000 if...

1 week ago

John Millsteadcreated the topic: CougarPaws vs. Felt Waders

Do you have experience with both CougarPaws and Felt bottomed waders?

1 week ago

Tim Wieneke, AICreplied to: RE: What state licenses should an adjuster have?

Rasar,
I got the NY license and of the 14 licenses I've gotten, it is the most difficult.  I don't know if California is harder.  Having th...

3 weeks ago

Rebeccareplied to: RE: What state licenses should an adjuster have?

Rasar,
I have my NY License and you want to know how difficult it is to obtain.  I believe it depends on your Persistence.  Independent Ins...

3 weeks ago

SpartanCATreplied to: RE: Rope Access Standards for Pitched Roofing Systems

Where, other than Texas, can an individual be ACRABAT trained? I live in Michigan but am very interested in getting this training. Thanks in ...

1 month ago

SpartanCATreplied to: RE: Steep Roof - Rope and Harness

Is anyone aware of any rope and harness training courses in the salt lake city, Utah area?

1 month ago

Royreplied to: RE: Oklahoma Earthquake CE Requirement

The below is from a 9/7 news article on IFAwebnews.com 
 
"Oklahoma Gov. Mary Fallin approved an emergency rule adopted by Oklahoma I...

1 month ago

Roycreated the topic: Oklahoma Earthquake CE Requirement

The text below comes from the attached DOI Bulletin
To: Oklahoma Continuing Education Providers
From: OID Education Division
Date: August 5, 2014
...

1 month ago

Catastrophe Central, Discuss, Share, Learn

Independent Claims Adjuster Apprentice Program
Last Post 09/13/2010 6:01 PM by Ray Hall. 16 Replies.
AddThis - Bookmarking and Sharing Button Printer Friendly
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  
Sort:
PrevPrev NextNext
You are not authorized to post a reply.
Author Messages
CatAdjusterX
Posts:964


--
06/05/2010 4:35 AM
    Hello folks
     
    Of many important topics discussed on most ADJUSTER related websites, the most common subject and easily the most "contentious"  topic seems to be the mass exodus of individuals that have swelled our ranks long past the point of "SATURATION" 
     
    We can almost trace this exodus to it's beginning as I myself came to this industry(along with many others) back in 2004 in response to the 4 hurricanes that made landfall in quick succession on the Florida peninsula.
     
    Then came the storied 2005 Storm season that brought us hurricanes Katrina and Rita.
     
    These EPIC storm seasons brought some interesting facts to the many folks who were just beginning to suffer from the effects of the downward spiral of our Nation's economy which was now moving towards mass layoffs, the slowdown of the Construction industry (which as we all know now is at a standstill)
     
    Folks became aware of how much money there was to be made in the Adjusting Industry and because of the overwhelming number of claims filed from these two seasons, the Insurance carrier's and Independent adjusting firms were scrambling trying to find enough people required to put "BOOTS ON THE GROUND" and were forced to literally put almost anyone with a "pulse" out in the field and thrust into the position of an ""ADJUSTER", these new "adjuster's" thought "WOW, I AM MAKING SO MUCH MONEY AND THE FACT OF HAVING NO EXPERIENCE MUST MEAN BEING AN ADJUSTER IS EASY MONEY !!!! "
     
    Just thinking back to so many folks who were flipping burgers on a Friday, through these mass cattle calls, were herded through a weekend seminar and on Monday were now tasked with putting the insureds lives back together by trying to adequately  asses the damage's to these damaged properties with ZERO KNOWLEDGE of what they were doing, It's not hard to see why our industry is where it is now.
     
    Many of these instant "STORM TROOPERS" and the horrific mistakes they made from being thrust into a position they were not qualified to handle along with certain Carriers putting profits ahead of Customer Service has given rise to and contributed to the EXPLOSION of  Insureds being represented by Public Adjusters and Attorney's.
     
    These days there are so many "schools" popping up everywhere offering a 3 day course for a few hundred bucks  and almost anybody can be an adjuster.
     
    With the state of our economy , folks from many defunct industry are coming to our neck of the woods in droves wanting in on "THE GRAVY TRAIN".
     
    We cannot blame them, they are just trying to survive and we would all do the same thing to feed our families..
     
    So , here we are, those of us with some experience( DO NOT MISUNDERSTAND ME AS WHILE I HAVE 6 YEARS OF CLAIMS EXPERIENCE , I STILL BELIEVE MYSELF A NEWCOMER COMPARED WITH OUR INDUSTRY VETERAN'S WITH 10 ,20 YEARS OF CLAIMS EXPERIENCE)  watching our industry become completely saturated with inexperienced folks  and our deployment opportunities are becoming fewer and farther in between and when we do get deployed, we are seeing our fee schedules becoming ever smaller because the one entity that may have benefited from the influx of new adjusters is the Carriers and they can now fill their ranks of deploying adjuster's with those who are new to the industry and will work these claims for a lot less than an experienced adjuster would because many of these folks are coming from a world where they were working for wages around 10.00 to 12.00 an hour and to those folks , even a reduced fee schedule is much more than the wages of their prior industry.
     
    I have a site dedicated to helping these folks and I have always tried to point them in the right direction and I will continue to do so because of the dozens of folks who were with me in my training course and licensing school when I started back in 04', I am the only one left and the only who was fortunate enough and LUCKY enough to work continuously up until my accident back in October of 2009 (another story entirely)
     
    The only reason I am still here and been able to find some degree of success is because of a group of "OLD SCHOOL ADJUSTERS" who took me under their wing and taught me not just how to do claims and inspections, they taught me how to be an adjuster !!
     
    I will never forget what those guys did for me and is why I will help as many new folks as I can and try to put them down the path of becoming an adjuster and not just someone out to make a quick buck.
     
    No matter how much we don't like the direction our Industry is headed, no matter how many "GOOD OLE BOYS" voice their disapproval , no matter how many newbies get ripped apart when they come on the adjuster forum's asking for guidance, the fact is these new folks are going to continue coming to our industry because where else our they going to go ?
     
    Most folks are coming to our industry because they have too, there are no other options and who are we to ridicule somebody who is guilty of trying to feed their families and make a better world for their children and themselves ? 
     
    We cannot stop them from coming, so we can sit around and rip them apart but that doesn't change anything !!
     
    All we can do is try to educate them, explain this is not the "GRAVY TRAIN" and being an adjuster is not "EASY MONEY" and try and point them in the right direction.
     
    I strongly believe that receiving an adjuster's license DOES NOT  make somebody an adjuster and a license should be not entitle an inexperienced person to do claims, I believe it should entitle the holder of said document as a license to learn !!
     
    Florida has initiated a new statute that as of now only pertains to new Public Adjusters in that they must go through an Apprentice period, I believe it is for a period of 2 years that they must accompany an experienced licensed Public Adjuster before they can become a full fledged licensed Public Adjuster.
     
    Why can't this wonderful statute apply to all new adjusters whether a PA or an IA, I honestly believe that no brand new person in our industry with a newly printed adjuster's license has the knowledge nor experience to competently handle a claim from start to finish.
     
    Whilst I did not go through a 2 year apprentice period, my whole experience for the 8 months or so that I was deployed for hurricane Jeanne, I was not allowed to do a claim by myself, I was not allowed to go near any adjusting software until I had learned how to competently scope a risk from start to finish, every room , every square foot of the exterior, every square on a roof with nothing more than a pad ,a pencil, a tape measure and a camera.
     
    I remember being so angry , felt I was being used by these 'old school guys" I was getting picked on , doing the grunt work while all my buddies were doing there own claims with other companies by themselves, with their adjusting software making the "BIG BUCKS" !!
     
    By the time my firm was done with our little corner of the world, I had still not done an entire claim by myself , I had been under the watchful eye of an experienced adjuster and while I made decent money , it was not what my buddies made, not even close.
     
    The powers that be decided I had demonstrated a working knowledge of competently handling a claim and decided I could begin handling my own claims when I was deployed to the next event whenever that occurred.
     
    I didn't have to wait long before Katrina and Rita reared their ugly heads and found my firm along with myself deployed to that chaotic wasteland that used to be Southern Louisiana and Southern Mississippi !!
     
    I remember so clearly how I would lay in bed at night before Katrina/Rita hoping and wishing for a hurricane to blow through somewhere so I could get work !!
    Well I got my wish and I felt so awful inside for wishing this disaster on these folks so I could make a buck, seeing so many homes obliterated and peoples ways of life forever altered and seeing people who's whole family had drowned, for as long as I am able to be an adjuster , I will never EVER write another post about hoping for a hurricane to make landfall so I can work.
     
    When I was cut loose on my own , I felt confident and I felt I knew what I was doing and I was efficient and effective, of course I asked questions, but my core base of knowledge was strong and I stayed on Katrina/Rita from October of 2005 till February of 2007.
    I worked the Southern California wildfires in 2007, Gustav in 2008 and back in Southern California for the wildfires of 2009 until my accident, all for the same firm.
     
    All my buddies from My licensing class, they worked Katrina/Rita, they all washed out from that storm except for one and he quit the industry after not finding work after Katrina/Rita.
    I envied these guys during Jeanne because they were thrown out there on their own , but they are all gone now, I fully believe it was because they did not have the knowledge nor support system , I didn't like being an apprentice when I was new but it made the difference in who I am today.
     
    I think all new IA's should have to apprentice before they are cut loose on their own before they can truly become an adjuster, spend 2 years under an experienced adjusting firms guidance and tutelage and after that period of time if they can demonstrate a working knowledge of working a claim from start to finish, they can be awarded the coveted title of an adjuster and then receive an adjusters license.
     
    Many will disagree with me on this
    I believe most carrier's would oppose an apprentice program, but who knows, maybe someday it will happen, that would go along way towards addressing the problems in our industry in regards to poor adjusting skills leading to claims being reopened by PA's or attorney repped insureds, it won't stop all the claims being reopened as many claims being reopened have nothing to do with what the adjuster did, it has to do with upper management decisions on declining higher payment's and some have to do with the greed of some insureds , PA's and Attorney's.
     
    Whether or not an Apprentice program is ever implemented by states other than Florida or wherever, I will never forget what those guys did for me way back when during Jeanne and I will continue to help as many new folks as I can in the hopes that one day , these guys I am helping now will be able to help those folks that are now the new guys
     
           
    Robby Robinson
     
      
    "A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
    linhoch
    Member
    Member
    Posts:33


    --
    06/06/2010 2:01 PM
    That was pretty comprehensive. There is nothing to add, but I hate to see such an insightful post languishing by itself.

    We do not all bring the same acumen to the party. I have spent most of my adult life adjusting claims and have become pretty good at it. Even at that, some agree about that and some do not.

    My memory base supports my present experience and action. This is so basic a concept that it is an assumption. Yet we dance around it all the time. It has fueled arguments here for years. E.g., I can put on a mechanic’s overalls and maybe get a mechanic’s license, but I can’t fix your car unless I happen to have the learning and experience to fix it.

    This assumption has run aground so often that states issue licenses for areas where trouble has lurked. It is illegal for me take out your appendix unless I have a license because harm has been done by those who practiced without a license

    . But all licenses are not regarded with the same aura of prestige. Although doctors have nurses who do all the work except surgery and lawyers have paralegals who do all the work except court appearances, nurses and paralegals are not going to usurp the doctor and lawyer jobs. The law protects true professionals like doctors and lawyers.

    Adjusters are not true professionals. In Texas, the first adjuster licenses were printed on the back of the pawnbroker license. Almost anyone can get an adjuster license in a week. It does not indicate the skill or acumen of the holder.

    But there is a movement afoot that comes out of a Neuro Linguistic Programming approach. It is a quiet subtextual undercurrent that is having a huge impact. It implies, without actually stating, that if I match and mirror your activity, then I am doing what you do and can replace you as easily as you replace your jump drive. It challenges the assumption that I must learn to do something and then do it for a while before I can be skilled at it.

    If you get your license and can present a good appearance, can put together an estimate and report per instructions, then you can do what I do and can be paid the same as I am. In fact, you may be more gregarious and work for 10% less, so you may replace me permanently.

    I have noticed that not everyone brings the same acumen to the party. I have met a couple of adjusters who seem to be as good as I am who have a much shorter history. They are smarter than I am. They are better. They are Me 2.0. Upgrades.

    It is not politically correct to say that I am better than you, even if it’s true. But I can still notice out loud that you are doing really good work, even though you have not been at it very long. I can say that you perform better than I without ruffling too many feathers. But if your knowledge base is shallow, you may get into trouble, i.e., make “horrific mistakes.”

    Some IA firms and carriers have tried to prevent this trouble by adding testing and supervision. But any level of organization can only juggle so many balls. After a hurricane is when the merry-go-round breaks down.

    An old adjuster was telling us about three adjusters in succession who were sent to his house on the Gulf after Ike. They all failed in a pitiful fashion because they were 2.0, but they only had 125mb of Ram and the job needed at least a gig. He finally wrote the estimate himself on the third adjuster’s laptop and told him how to write the report.

    This was after all the schools and tests and layers of supervision that should have done the triage that sent only the most experienced to the beach. The volume exceeded the system’s level of organization. It always will because the solution to today’s problem becomes tomorrow’s problem. Einstein is said to have said that the mindset that created a problem cannot solve it. It just creates more problems.

    Effective training and mentoring takes time and a standard work flowchart cannot capture the nuances of human interaction as opposed to people skills, understanding of contracts of insurance as opposed to coverage cheat sheets, writing an estimate if you have never swung a hammer, conveying empathy if you have never had a hangnail, etc.

    The nature of the real problem is that short term profits do not lie. That frame of mind will not solve the competence problem until the short term cost of defending “horrific mistakes” exceeds the cost of training and mentoring. If companies would rise to just the level of pride, they would be embarrassed to send to ignorance out to represent them.

    Steve H
    brighton
    Advanced Member
    Advanced Member
    Posts:135


    --
    06/06/2010 8:36 PM
    Both of the above are very good posts.

    To begin the transition from what we see today the states have to stop looking at licensing as a source of revenue. Iinstill requirements that would cause the license to mean something. How about a minimum number of hours per line of business with at least three lines required in order to apply for the license? Something like Basic license would be Auto, Property and Workers Comp. Each requiring at least 40 hours training for a minimum of 120 hours. If you want Bodily Injury, Bond, etc each would be another 40 hours of classroom training. Compare this to what we see today and we would see those who really wants to be in this business. Not a lot of "I want the big money I have read about." would spend that type of money. Add in a 12 month aprentice program and the numbers would drop dramatically in licenses issued. What is $299 (that alone cheapens the claims handling business) when you are gambling on a whole lot more if 'Da Big 'Un comes in.

    However, I do not see this occuring. States need revenue and having real requirements would reduce the revenue. Carriers know that there are so many license holders out there that they can keep the cost of doing an appraisal low. With all the upstart vendors cutting prices or accepting what the carriers say they will pay just to get work nothing will change. Imagine having a smaller pool of those who are really qualified.
    Rocke Baker
    rickval
    Guest
    Guest
    Posts:5


    --
    06/07/2010 9:07 PM
    i agree with linhoch.

    i am a newly licensed IA. but for 39 years i have been a GC. 34 years in ny and elsewhere on disaster repairs and 5 years as a licensed GC in florida. i did millions of dollars in repairs for the individuals hurt or homeless by the 04/05 hurricane season. i was there in johnstown, pa; boston, ma; and kansas city floods. as a GC we had the same type of comments; like you can make millions being a GC in disasters, yeah, right. i worked my cahoonies off. 20 hour days, living in a rented junkstore with a 6 mil poly shower, and sleeping on pallets. talk about dealing with the people, trust me , i do understand. i dealt with IA's, lawyers- to try to get paid, PA's . yet the ongoing belief was that someone could step in and simply make a million dollars. my response....try it, knock yourself out. some were successful, those who weren't just gave us more work. and once folks get their check , they want to make a profit. i have been told directly that they deserve to get all the repairs done and still buy a new car or tv or such. and then refuse to pay me because of some bs excuse. as i see it, being an adjuster is no more nor no less complicated than being a GC . i am certain it will be just as much a pain in the butt. however, i have persevered for many years and will not yet give up , because it may be hard or complicated. i do not think it is fair to newcomers to belittle or underestimate their capabilities just because they are not as experienced as you or i may be in respective industries. some people can grasp things faster than we can, some are simply smarter or harder working.
    my goal is to be an awesome adjuster, not just for me, but for you guys also. because if i am , then you guys will look even better. that is what will give credability to the trade. i , too, am looking for a mentor. why? because you know more than i do as an experienced adjuster. and i respect that. i am certain there are know it alls out there, same in my old profession as in any. i do not want to be that guy. all that being said , if any of you folks are interested in taking someone under your wing, let me know. i would appreciate it! contact rick.tabulgater@gmail.com thanks
    Dimechimes
    Senior Member
    Senior Member
    Posts:196


    --
    06/10/2010 4:12 AM
    Outstanding posts.
     
    Thankfully, I think some of the 3 day schooll issues will be history by next year and hopefully the requirements that that you have to take so many individual carrrier certification tests.
     
    I'll have a complete blog up by the weekend up with more details but here is a link to suggested detailed reading on the new Property Technical Certification program in testing now through August through KMConDemand the online training arm of Crawford and Company. This is to go live in September now that minor questions are resolved on proctor issues and other things. Just take a look at the committee list with executives from major carriers on the committee as well as major players from large independent firms. I post this link with the permission of the head of KMConDemand since I now have approval to release the information:
     
    www.kmcondemand.com/ptc This link has all the info on the current plans consisting of PTC 1, PTC 2, PTC 3  agendas.
    http://www.kmcondemand.com/ptc/index.php?Page=dynamic&id=66  This link has the link to all committee members.
     
     The material is outstanding and a far cry from some of the problems adjusters complain of at outside vendor schools.  I am most hopeful the insurance carriers agree to this replacing all of the individual carrier certifications so we anxiously await the testing period results so this can go live.
     
    My husband is a newly licensed adjuster so I got to watch while he did the classes when I had time for the regular series of online classes. They had 15 programs at that time and I think have now added 6 more. For 135.00, he was able to take 5 classes in WC, 5  in auto and 5 in property. All contained CE's.
    I have  been 100% sold on them since. I am also glad they are backed by Crawford who we all know has an outstanding reputation. Colm knows I'm probably his biggest fan and thrilled at what KMC has brought for such a reasonable cost to independents saving their travel costs. In addition, as a claims manager it brings me much comfort or safety net if you will to know they will be tested and the passing standards are high as well as proctored exams.
     
    This should take us a long way in helping improve the public perception and carrier perception of independent adjusters. Can you also just imagine how great this will be for independents no longer having travel costs to certify for multiple vendors and do these online. I'm sure keeping my fingers crossed for the independents that this does succeed and hope you will as well.
     
    Speaking of that- I hope you will share this blog post with other independents. We are trying to move mountains in getting BP to use more independent firms. Thanks so much to the claims managers and adjusters who have read it and written to let me know they have sent the link to politicians and news connections asking they get the word out that independents are the solution to clean up the BP Oil spill claims process:
     
    http://dimechimes.wordpress.com/2010/06/07/an-open-letter-to-admiral-thad-allen-president-obama-white-house-news-correspondents-esis-insurance-and-all-involved-in-the-bp-oil-response-we-can-help-address-your-claims-concerns-lead-follow/
     
    Sorry so long but I couldn't resist since you were speaking to two such hot topics in claims- deployments and claims education!
     
    Visit our Adjusters Information Blog
    www.dimechimes.wordpress.com www.Linkedin.com/in/dimechimesclaimSmentor www.Twitter.com/ClaimSmentor www.ClaimSmentor.com
    CatAdjusterX
    Posts:964


    --
    06/10/2010 6:21 AM
    Posted By Dimechimes on 10 Jun 2010 04:12 AM
    Outstanding posts.
     
    Thankfully, I think some of the 3 day schooll issues will be history by next year and hopefully the requirements that that you have to take so many individual carrrier certification tests.
     
    I'll have a complete blog up by the weekend up with more details but here is a link to suggested detailed reading on the new Property Technical Certification program in testing now through August through KMConDemand the online training arm of Crawford and Company. This is to go live in September now that minor questions are resolved on proctor issues and other things. Just take a look at the committee list with executives from major carriers on the committee as well as major players from large independent firms. I post this link with the permission of the head of KMConDemand since I now have approval to release the information:
     
    www.kmcondemand.com/ptc This link has all the info on the current plans consisting of PTC 1, PTC 2, PTC 3  agendas.
    http://www.kmcondemand.com/ptc/index.php?Page=dynamic&id=66  This link has the link to all committee members.
     
     The material is outstanding and a far cry from some of the problems adjusters complain of at outside vendor schools.  I am most hopeful the insurance carriers agree to this replacing all of the individual carrier certifications so we anxiously await the testing period results so this can go live.
     
    My husband is a newly licensed adjuster so I got to watch while he did the classes when I had time for the regular series of online classes. They had 15 programs at that time and I think have now added 6 more. For 135.00, he was able to take 5 classes in WC, 5  in auto and 5 in property. All contained CE's.
    I have  been 100% sold on them since. I am also glad they are backed by Crawford who we all know has an outstanding reputation. Colm knows I'm probably his biggest fan and thrilled at what KMC has brought for such a reasonable cost to independents saving their travel costs. In addition, as a claims manager it brings me much comfort or safety net if you will to know they will be tested and the passing standards are high as well as proctored exams.
     
    This should take us a long way in helping improve the public perception and carrier perception of independent adjusters. Can you also just imagine how great this will be for independents no longer having travel costs to certify for multiple vendors and do these online. I'm sure keeping my fingers crossed for the independents that this does succeed and hope you will as well.
     
    Speaking of that- I hope you will share this blog post with other independents. We are trying to move mountains in getting BP to use more independent firms. Thanks so much to the claims managers and adjusters who have read it and written to let me know they have sent the link to politicians and news connections asking they get the word out that independents are the solution to clean up the BP Oil spill claims process:
     
    http://dimechimes.wordpress.com/2010/06/07/an-open-letter-to-admiral-thad-allen-president-obama-white-house-news-correspondents-esis-insurance-and-all-involved-in-the-bp-oil-response-we-can-help-address-your-claims-concerns-lead-follow/
     
    Sorry so long but I couldn't resist since you were speaking to two such hot topics in claims- deployments and claims education!
     

    Hello Ms. Debbie
    This is wonderful and indeed would be helping out many IA's overhead and massive savings on travel costs should this be accepted, your efforts are hugely appreciated
     
    Robby Robinson
    "A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
    Dimechimes
    Senior Member
    Senior Member
    Posts:196


    --
    06/11/2010 12:35 AM
    Thanks Robby- I am very excited about this program after viewing the course material. I have to say it is the best program I have found researching courses for independents that will actually  teach them a-z property adjusting in this 3 part series. Such a wonderful program and no travel and carrier supported program- you can't beat that! There are so many good CE sites and the way I see thiis as being so different is the a-z factor where a new independent can for 1 much smaller fee than being charged for field courses take this on line around their own schedule. We all beat to a different drummer and don't learn at the same pace. My husband really enjoyed being able to take the ones he did around his work schedule and his NASCAR shows!
    Visit our Adjusters Information Blog
    www.dimechimes.wordpress.com www.Linkedin.com/in/dimechimesclaimSmentor www.Twitter.com/ClaimSmentor www.ClaimSmentor.com
    Ray Hall
    Posts:2443


    --
    06/21/2010 9:53 AM
    Just re-read this post for the 2nd time. Now is the time to learn estimating programs any way you can. If you have never seen a closed file that must be sent to the vendor  and then the carrier it can have from 6 to 10 pages printed on standard paper or PDF format by email. These are some of the requirements of the insurance s on almost ever claim assigned to an IA adjuster. The most basic is a line item estimate of the direct damage estimate to a building starting on the roof and working down. The first area of a wind claim is the roof, then the exterior. The exterior is the soffit, facia, gutters, siding, windows and doors. Then the interior of the house. Its always best to start with the entrance door room and then go around the house in a CW or CCW manner and list all the rooms WITH DAMAGE with the operation necessary to repair the storm damage from top to bottom. (Keep in mind some person is reading this file and you want it to flow with the estimate and photo,s submitted)
     
    By this time your estimate will began to tell the picture of the damage and look something like this. AREAS DAMAGED 1. Roof, 2 Gutter, 3 Siding, 4 windows, 5 Doors, Interior 1. Entry Foyer, 2 Living Area, 3 Dining Room, Kitchen, Master Bedroom, Master Bath, Hallway, Hall Bath, Judys BR, Franks BR, Utility , Attached garage etc. ( IF some rooms are not damaged do not have a line item, but have the measurements ****)
     
    Most all programs have a Statement of Loss this is a total recap of the adjustment such as. Total Replacement Cost $20,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Less Depreciation               5,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Actual Cash Value Loss  $15,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Less Wind Deductible         1,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Check Requested           $14,000.00
     
    Print two 4x6 six digital photos to each page . Label them (do not be lazy-wormey- half assed)  #1 Looking N
                                                                                                                                                                Front elevation
                                                                                                                                                             #2 Looking W elevation, #3 Looking S, rear elevation(falling treedamaged storm door)
     
    #3. Long shoot looking E total loss of front and rear slopes(wide angel of both slopes) 4, Looking N Long shot of destroyed solar panel.
     
    Then do the APS
     
     Then do the ALE
      Then do the contents UPP I can email some old files to review if you will estimate your own house and send to me in PDF. rhrayhall@gmail.com
    CatAdjusterX
    Posts:964


    --
    06/22/2010 3:37 PM
    Enogh said !!
     
    Priceless, Ray, Thank you !!
     
     
    Robby Robinson
    "A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
    CatAdjusterX
    Posts:964


    --
    06/23/2010 7:21 PM
    Posted By Ray Hall on 21 Jun 2010 09:53 AM
    Just re-read this post for the 2nd time. Now is the time to learn estimating programs any way you can. If you have never seen a closed file that must be sent to the vendor  and then the carrier it can have from 6 to 10 pages printed on standard paper or PDF format by email. These are some of the requirements of the insurance s on almost ever claim assigned to an IA adjuster. The most basic is a line item estimate of the direct damage estimate to a building starting on the roof and working down. The first area of a wind claim is the roof, then the exterior. The exterior is the soffit, facia, gutters, siding, windows and doors. Then the interior of the house. Its always best to start with the entrance door room and then go around the house in a CW or CCW manner and list all the rooms WITH DAMAGE with the operation necessary to repair the storm damage from top to bottom. (Keep in mind some person is reading this file and you want it to flow with the estimate and photo,s submitted)
     
    By this time your estimate will began to tell the picture of the damage and look something like this. AREAS DAMAGED 1. Roof, 2 Gutter, 3 Siding, 4 windows, 5 Doors, Interior 1. Entry Foyer, 2 Living Area, 3 Dining Room, Kitchen, Master Bedroom, Master Bath, Hallway, Hall Bath, Judys BR, Franks BR, Utility , Attached garage etc. ( IF some rooms are not damaged do not have a line item, but have the measurements ****)
     
    Most all programs have a Statement of Loss this is a total recap of the adjustment such as. Total Replacement Cost $20,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Less Depreciation               5,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Actual Cash Value Loss  $15,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Less Wind Deductible         1,000.00
                                                                                                                                                       Check Requested           $14,000.00
     
    Print two 4x6 six digital photos to each page . Label them (do not be lazy-wormey- half assed)  #1 Looking N
                                                                                                                                                                Front elevation
                                                                                                                                                             #2 Looking W elevation, #3 Looking S, rear elevation(falling treedamaged storm door)
     
    #3. Long shoot looking E total loss of front and rear slopes(wide angel of both slopes) 4, Looking N Long shot of destroyed solar panel.
     
    Then do the APS
     
     Then do the ALE
      Then do the contents UPP I can email some old files to review if you will estimate your own house and send to me in PDF. rhrayhall@gmail.com


    Hey Ray
     
    I set up a basic scenario where my guys were to assume a tree fell on their own house came thru the exterior wall on the East elevation , severely damaged roof and opened up and exposed X amount of rooms, bedroom 1 & 2 , Hall bath, Master bedroom & master bath , living room.
     
    I am awed that some guys are actually hard at work and I am sending you the first completed from a new adjuster( never been deployed ) level 1 Xactimate and will be in your gmail inbox momentarily in PDF.
     
    please advise
     
    Robby Robinson
     
    "A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
    jdacree
    Veteran Member
    Veteran Member
    Posts:161


    --
    08/22/2010 8:26 AM
    All of the above posts are well written and define a true need for the industry. Any of you that have worked in any industry are well aware of the need to have some form of training system in which the bright newbe is taught the ropes by an older experienced hand. Any symbotic enviornment in which the experienced hand transfers all of the experience, including "don't you knows" keeps the knowledge base alive. Any industry, or company that has not instituted some form of this process is the industry, company that stagnates and cannot suppy the end user what they need.

    During the past week I attended an orientation with one of the "Big 5". One of the items that they mentioned was the formulation of a mentor program they were studying in which those applicants with no field experience, but strong skills in construction, customer service, technology maight be put with an experienced hand to learn how this company did a file. This mentoring program would supply the un-experienced with a venue to learn, while allowing this "apprentice" to be able to make some sort of living while in the program. At first blush this organization appears to understand the need to get soe people trained in a manner that does not embaress the organization when the **it hits the fan, and they have to deploy. During my interview with thier personnel, I told them that I felt this to be a very good porcess to persue. At the current time it appears that there are a weath of individuals out there that want to get the proper training/education to be able to contribute when deployed, not just take the money and run. In our forum here, there have been a number of persons asking for the opportunity to learn in this manner, to no avail.

    For the most part, a newbie working with an experienced hand, while gaing very good experience, has no venue to put that experience on his resume. All of the claims worked on and closed go in under the experienced adjusters name. It is a rare HR department that allowes OJT as claims experience. In many cases the OJT can be discounted with the simple question, who was the instructor and what are HIS quaalifications. I feel that this industry does need to come up with some standardized traing, and a recogonized OJT program that can be listed as is all licenses and certifications gained.

    Just my inexperienced 2 cents worth.
    Jim Acree Stupidity is the art of not trying to learn Ignorance is the lack of opportunity to learn I am ignorant
    Ray Hall
    Posts:2443


    --
    08/22/2010 1:53 PM
    Good post Jim. I know the big five vendors have culled the resumes for years and invited the new people to an interview. Many good cat. adjusters have been trained in the last 5-6 years by these forward thinking vendors. On the other hand we have the rest or the have nots on a grade of 1 to 10. I will not try to grade them as their own balance sheet will do this....... know before you go......
    Ray Hall
    Posts:2443


    --
    08/22/2010 1:58 PM
    To be fair, I would also include good IA firms like RJW, C & L, C &C,GAB,Wardlow, ASU ,  Simsol, Sweet and several more.
    rickval
    Guest
    Guest
    Posts:5


    --
    09/13/2010 5:18 AM
    I have taken corses, training, exams til my head has burst. only now do I realize that most of the current training courses have been to ENTICE new comers to make $800-1200.00 per day is simply a way to keep the bucks coming in while waiting for a large hurricane event. We are told that we are placed on rosters and WILL be called. I am not so sure. I really believe that anything from the 8 day courses to the boot camps have no real bearing on becoming an adjuster other than a certificate issued. It seems that it is the ajusting companies that have let the ajusters down by saturating the business for their own gain.
    Ol' Ghost
    Senior Member
    Senior Member
    Posts:279


    --
    09/13/2010 4:32 PM
    AAH-HAH!!! This pilgrim has seen the LIGHT!!!

    Yes, it's a pretty slick trick for the IA's Firms Schools to keep the tent poles propped up while waiting for the storms to roll in. And it's all on your nickles and dimes, pilgrim. Here's another tidbit of knowledge, all you 'students' are being graded as to who is worth keeping. This means most or even all of you in a class may not be called out when the monster storm blows down the doors. Try that on for size. Your grade may be meaningless if the wart on your nose is too big or your car in the parking lot is the wrong color.

    The flip side of the coin is the 26 year old exotic dancer sitting across the room will always be called out before you do, regardless of how many sterling qualities you have. Ain't life great!

    Ol'Ghost
    olderthendirt
    Veteran Member
    Veteran Member
    Posts:148


    --
    09/13/2010 4:39 PM
    Interest how people attending these rockie trainning camps always seem to talk to someone who made big $$$$ recently. Anyone remember what a shill is? But who would ude one to entice people into more classes, no one in this industry for sure.
    Life is like a sewer, what you get out of it depends on what you put in it
    Ray Hall
    Posts:2443


    --
    09/13/2010 6:01 PM

    I have always been amazed when a large group of adjusters are in the same room like 200, if they checked them as the company rep. only about 10% would be kept. All these should be bye bye missing real teeth or dentures, dirty clothes, work boots, the oldest clothes they have, need a haircut, unkemp facial hair, bad breath, smell like you slept in the truck.  You get the picture.

    You are not authorized to post a reply.


    These Forums are dedicated to discussion of Claims Adjusting.

    For the benefit of the community and to protect the integrity of the ecosystem, please observe the following posting guidelines: 
    • No Advertising. 
    • No vendor trolling / poaching. If someone posts about a vendor issue, allow the vendor or others to respond. Any post that looks like trolling / poaching will be removed.
    • No Flaming or Trolling.
    • No Profanity, Racism, or Prejudice.
    • Terms of Use Apply

      Site Moderators have the final word on approving / removing a thread or post or comment.

    We are insurance adjusters that travel the world handling claims from natural and man-made catastrophes.