| Author |
 Topic  |
|
CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
 Posted - 04/23/2003 : 09:53:50
|
The 'Buster made some interesting comments in his 04/23 08.30 AM post in the "Hail" thread. It is worthy of reading in its entirety.
I'd like to bring part of that forward to this new thread, so as not to dilute the interesting mechanics of the "Hail" thread.
True - as Ghost suggested - basic human nature will reduce all things to the lowest common denominator; unless there is an outside force to maintain the standards.
True - as Ghost suggested - independent contractors crusading as "adjusters"; do not have such a force of control.
However, I am puzzled by a further sentence that 'Buster added; relative to the "because" and the "bug". That sentence is, "we do not because the insurance industry squashes that bug before it can hatch".
That quote of that sentence from Ghostbuster's comments in the "Hail" thread, suggests to me that;
(a) "we" or some collection of "adjusters" have attempted to plan, or to have, or to implement (i.e the "Bug" as he says) a "force of control"; perhaps like doctors, accountants or engineers may have for their professional bodies
(b) the "insurance industry" (and I'm not sure what segment of it) has squashed, or stopped, or avoided it from happening, or crushed any attempts "we" have made; as per the efforts suggested in (a) above
First, the "bug" (as per "a" above). Could others please give me examples of when and how "adjusters" tried to incubate and hatch that "bug", that would / could become a "force of control"?
Second, the "because" (as per "b" above). Could others please give me examples of when and how the "insurance industry" squashed that "bug(s)" in its incubation stage?
I'm primarily interested in specific examples of each issue, that can be identified since January 1, 2000. However, it would be interesting to review any instances of incubation and subsequent eradication, that had a life cycle in the last five years.
I always thought that the "bug" repellent was being squirted differently than suggested.
|
Edited by - CCarr on 04/23/2003 21:17:12 |
|
|
Newt
USA
657 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2003 : 12:29:22
|
Bugs that do not expose their eggs(short commings) do not get squashed.
Bugs that are loud and found to be invasive get squashed.
Bugs that are destructive (cost you money) get exterminated.
Only the German Cock Roach is smart enough to carry the eggs with her and stay out of sight when the light is turned on. Some don't and as a result the bugman is called in (insurers) and they exterminate or exclude the whole lot.
I think the control lies in the power of the the Vendor at the present time, the screening is not happening. Experience is difficult to track if you don't have a system. Every one seems to have a boarding pass, so who is to know who is going to High Jack the ship. Every one says "not me, I am pure as the driven snow". You, nor the vendor are policing the act so it is left to the carrier to find a solution and it seems that is in the making. This is my point of view from the sidelines, being a bench warmer and not in the game, it is a view from outside looking in.
|
 |
|
|
Newt
USA
657 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2003 : 12:51:49
|
There are a few vendors out there that are doing a first rate job in training, that is having some impact on this field. The carriers look to the vendors for good people and it is the adjusters who make or break the vendors, even themselves if they don't take the advantages of educating themselves and whats offered. If any one gets squashed it attracts attention to the group, all suffer in the end.
This forum is the adjusters display window and lots of people window shop here. If you can't be good look pretty. I cannot look pretty so I better be good.:>) |
|
|
|
CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2003 : 13:55:14
|
| Newt, from your two posts, have you provided in your comments any examples I was looking for, regarding adjuster created incubating "bugs" or insurance industry eradication of the emerging bugs? |
|
|
|
Newt
USA
657 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2003 : 23:30:06
|
Probably not, because I didn't understand the question. I don't think the adjusters are incubating any bugs nor do I believe the industry is trying to eradicate any. They are working with numbers, getting the most bang for their buck. This is a disaster driven field and the Cat Adjuster depend on storms, accidents and freaks of nature for survival.
If there was a hint of an assn. only a few are for it, so thats dead in the water. This forum is the nearest thing we have to an organization. |
|
|
|
LAW1526
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2003 : 09:21:40
|
| Clayton I agree with Newt, I'm not sure I completly understand the the question. |
|
|
|
Ghostbuster
476 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2003 : 14:13:27
|
WHOA, HOSS! (WHACK!!) WHEN I SAY WHOA, I mean WHOA!
It appears the great cosmic forces are befuddled as to the intent of this thread. Please allow me a moment to clarify the issue. Thank you for your patience.
This all started during a Mother Of ALL Headaches I had while posting in another thread. The post dealt with the human tendency to descend to the level of the lowest common denominator in any activity UNLESS there was an outside force to keep the level of activity on a 'higher plane', (as it were). Okay, LCD = Lowest Common Denominator. The analogy of Homer Simpson has the Lowest and Common is a constant theme running thru the cartoon show, 'The Simpsons'. The comparasion of Homer to the other topic of the thread, (at the time of writing that post), the dubious level of quality in being a Run & Gunner was my intent.
Also, being under the influence of 8 Walmart PIRIN pills, (that's aspirin with the 'A' and the 'S' scraped off), I composed a sentiment about how companies do not like their employees associating with employees from other companies that perform the same job function. This, as well, ties into our lack of interest in forming a strong professional association to protect our interests like the lawyers and doctors have.
Is that any clearer? I know that often my thought processes lack total clarity and given the constraints of time and attention spans, ideas that seem crystal clear in my dispeptic mind wind up as confused mush here on the screen. For that I do apologize. For those further behind on the conveyor belt of time, please remember that getting an AARP card means that you can now run around all day with your pants unzipped with a clear conscience and ramble and pontifcate like the Know-It-All you always knew you were in the first place.
So...that said, the intent of THIS thread is to expand on the thought of how the concepts of outside the company organizations tend to get 'squashed like a bug'. Get it? |
|
|
|
LAW1526
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2003 : 16:11:37
|
Let me give this shot.
I have on numerous occasions been asked by claim managers to see if I can fix a (Run & Gunner) file. First I would like to say, I could not believe the IA file examiners released the file to the carriers examiner.
One I remember a long time ago on a hurricane I received a hand written file with no log notes, Polaroid photos stapled to a blank sheet of paper one on top of the other like the ones you see in in those Photo Organizers, There was no caption information on any of the photos. No insured’s name or claim number written on the paper. The estimate had been hand written on a blank piece of paper with just some numbers written down and no captioned to what the numbers represented, totaled at the bottom less deductible. Again no insured’s name or claim number written on the paper. A diagram had been drawn on a blank piece of paper, again with no real documentation. The carriers file examiner had returned the file to be re-inspected.
I did another one not to long ago, where the adjuster had stated in his log notes that the roof was inaccessible and to steep to climb. The photos of the roof were all taken from the ground. The adjuster had indicated a significant amount of wind damage to a slate tile roof. In one of the photos the adjusters submitted with his file, showed the adjusters truck with an extension ladder secured to the ladder rack. His truck was sitting in front of the risk when he took the front view photo of the risk. The front view photo along with the adjusters truck showed an single story home with an 8’ high shed roof over the front porch and an 8-12 gable roof over the main house. The carriers file examiner rejected the file and wanted it re-inspected with roof measurements and photos. As it turned out there was much less damage to the roof than the adjuster had placed in his file. Another file that went to the carrier.
|
|
|
|
CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2003 : 16:20:13
|
Thanks for the effort Lenny, but it is not really what I was looking for, or what Ghostbuster had in mind; I think.
Anyway, your two "situations" are amazing; particularly the first one.
Tell us again that it is true, not that I don't doubt it; but it is pretty radical. I would really be interested in what year that happened. |
|
|
|
LAW1526
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/24/2003 : 18:02:13
|
| The year was 1998 or 1999 can't remember, Hurricane Flyod, NC, I'll keep trying until I get it right. |
|
|
|
LAW1526
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2003 : 19:13:20
|
I get it I think!!!. This subject has been discussed from all angles over the past 6 years I have been visiting this sight.
I personally was affiliated with an organization years ago called the The American Society of Safety Engineers (ASSE). To become a member required a degree in safety engineering or at least 5 years of verifiable work history within in that field of expertise along with an annually fee to maintain membership. Any one working within the Safety Engineering field strived to become a member of this organization. As a card-carrying member you belonged to a recognized professional organization much like the doctors, lawyers and other engineering disciplines belong to. By being a member to this organization assured your employer or if you were a consultant you maintained a level of training specific to your profession. This organization also helped standardize the industry and lobby for new laws form its membership.
This would be the type of organization I would recommend to the adjusting community.
I’m I getting closer yet?
|
|
|
|
CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2003 : 20:26:55
|
BINGO! That is it exactly Lenny.
Now, back to the two questions posed; the examples of the efforts by adjusters to plan or initiate such things, and examples of the suggested efforts by the insurance industry to squash these efforts.
Are there any? |
Edited by - CCarr on 04/25/2003 20:27:55 |
|
|
|
LAW1526
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2003 : 22:10:16
|
Clayton, Apparently I’m not aware of any activity focused on developing an organization like the one I had belonged to.
On this sight a few years back there was numerous discussion regarding the interest of forming an organization. I’m just not aware that any thing became of it. A fellow adjuster called me a while back and wanted to know why I was not at a convention he was attending being held in Las Vegas for adjusters. He mentioned the name of the organization but I was not aware of it. This individual made it sound as if it was a strong organization of adjuster. To become a member you had to have a sponsor and fill out an application. Are you aware of this group? Any way, he said he would sponsor me and send me an application.
I guess I really don’t have anything to contribute to this issue, unless you give me some more clues.
|
|
|
|
CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2003 : 22:20:45
|
It's me Lenny, that is looking for the clues.
Ghostbuster made a statement in the "Hail" thread, that I brought forward here. I wanted to know of examples of what adjusters had tried to do to create a force to maintain standards, as he suggested. I wanted to know examples of the insurance industry squashing those efforts, that he eluded to. I may be the one who interpreted his comments entirely wrong.
I am not familar with the Vegas event you mentioned. If it is not the grand puddle for geese with blue hair, it may be the National Insurance Adjusters Association, or it may be the other cat adjuster fraternity. |
|
|
|
Newt
USA
657 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2003 : 22:22:47
|
Ghost Buster, I understand and we have tried, the bug always gets squashed. Our intentions were noble and Jimmy Hoffa kept getting thrown in by the "nay sayers". A proffesional organization would be a good thing if run like other proffesionals do theirs.
I belonged to four and all without exception help me become better at what I did. It also gave us a voice in our field.
The four included:
1. National Assn.of Broadcasters
2. National Assn. of Educational Broadcasters
3. National Pest Control Assn.
4. National Independant Erector Assn.Charter member Dallas Chapter
Two others were Metal Building Assn. and Alabama Teachers Assn (AEA)
I can't understand why we cannot do the same, none of these organizations were nothing remotely resembled a union as such, it was a voice and a place to compare ideas and notes. It also gave us much needed educational benefits, and a chance to hone our skills.
As far as what goes on in the Ivory Tower of the Insurance Industry, an association would give us that information. I don't know what goes on there, except for my one visit to Big Red in B'ham. Every one I met went out of their way to talk to me. Knowing I was going to be an IA, didn't phase them. In fact each told me what an important roll the IAs played. This Web Site would make an excellent site to meet. Make it open to Adjusters regardless of how long they have been in the business. I think we need a commitee first, we have talent on here that could mastermind an Assn. we could all live with. This is not the time to "nit pick" and find fault with a system that would benefit all of us, we need help and we'll find it on the end of a lot of arms.
You can get that flame thrower out now. Just don't step on any bugs.
Ok. just came back on line, we have been without power and all the telephones were out. Ma Bell said it may be Tuesday before they got them fixed, I called them yesterday(FRI). Alabama took a hit yesterday and today, some hail, high wind and tornados. I only got four inches of rain last night. They had hail from nickle to baseball size. I don't know what the population density was. |
|
|
|
CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2003 : 22:32:23
|
Thanks Newt for identifying with the issues. Hopefully Ghostbuster or others, will provide examples to the two questions posed.
Out of interest, what kind of diagrams do you look at when you are an independent erector? |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
"LCD" versus Standards
Forum Locked
