Shingles not installed properly
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/21/2004 8:54:59 PM
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KileAnderson
Posts: 199
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Baton Rouge, LA
Status: offline
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I once saw them installed that way on a shed. I've never seen that on a house. Did you ask who installed them?
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/21/2004 10:31:29 PM
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katadj
Posts: 684
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: New Hope, PA
Status: offline
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ANY manufacturer will concur that the installation is improper. The insured may have a coarse of action against the "home inspection" provided.
The fact that the singles are installed incorrectley may fall under "latent defect"-"pre-existing condition"
or whatever else you can allude to.
Where was the agent's comment?
Why was it accepted as insurable? Why did the carrier accept the premium?
Lots of unanswered question's.
If there is NO direct physical damage, you do NOT have a covered loss to the roof materials. BUT, you may have a covered loss to the resultant interior damage, depending on the policy.
Have a fine day here in adjusting land.
_____________________________
"Excellence often first appears as error. It is only in retrospect that wisdom emerges from ignorance and success from failure." Abraham Lincoln
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/22/2004 6:30:13 AM
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LarryW
Posts: 202
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Grand Bay, AL
Status: offline
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Is this an improper installation? If there is a one whole tab offset rather than a one half tab offset, is the installation improper. Granted if there is no offset it would be improper, is that the case here?
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Larry Wright
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/22/2004 9:04:48 PM
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trader
Posts: 1200
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Houston, TX
Status: offline
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It was installed by some person who was not a roofer. I do not think any "all risk" coverage for interior damage would be covered by one or more exclusions.
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/22/2004 10:02:47 PM
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givemeroofs
Posts: 301
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Houston, Texas
Status: offline
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Jim,
Just and FYI this is a HOA named peril policy in Texas.
This was definately not installed by a professional roofer.
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/22/2004 10:06:06 PM
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givemeroofs
Posts: 301
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Houston, Texas
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Jim also poses a good question. Due to the age and condition of the roof, does this fall under "wear and tear" or any other exclusions on an all risk HOB or HO-3?
In the event this was a covered loss, could the carrier pursue subro against the installer?
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/23/2004 11:27:15 AM
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trader
Posts: 1200
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Houston, TX
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C. Faulty, inadequate or defective:
(2) design, specifications, workmanship, repair,construction, renovation, remodeling, materials used in repair, would be a start and inherent vice will be a finish.
All of the above exclusions will touch this shingle job.
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/23/2004 5:12:48 PM
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trader
Posts: 1200
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Home base: Houston, TX
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CC & Jim: I respect both of you guys post. still do and always will; however I need a copy of the HO-3 both of you are reading from. I have the HO-00 03 04 91 and the Allstate Delux Plus AP3 and also the State Farm HO-3 and the CP with most of the forms.
I would say all broad policys such as a HO-3 Texas HO-B and the DP3 will cover wind driven rain claims thru the roof or walls, but not under the doors. If a building is designed wrong, or is constructed wrong, or was repaired wrong the water intrusion to the interior is not covered under any policy that I have ever read.
< Message edited by trader -- 6/23/2004 5:23:43 PM >
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/23/2004 6:45:02 PM
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KileAnderson
Posts: 199
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Baton Rouge, LA
Status: offline
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Sorry, to tell you, but under the State Farm policy, the ensuing damage is covered. The shingles aren't covered, but the damage the water did insid is covered.
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/23/2004 7:25:50 PM
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givemeroofs
Posts: 301
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Houston, Texas
Status: offline
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How would the damage be classified if the shingles were improperly installed and 90% worn? No storm opening in the roof.
Would this not fall under the wear and tear exclusion?
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/23/2004 8:08:31 PM
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CCarr
Posts: 287
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Toronto, Ontario
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The 9th post of this thread set the course for the question of an HO3 covering this loss scenario.
Ray pointed out some exclusionary wording found in the HO3 0491, in the Section I - Exclusions area of the wording. That exclusionary wording was from Section I - Exclusions, #2, specifically from part (c), sub-part (2) and (3). Any of that language that Ray referred to would exclude the roofing in question if those thoughts and opinions were judged to be the technical reason for the damage. Or, call it "wear and tear"; it doesn't matter.
However, the preamble for Section I - Exclusions, #2, aside from confirming my last sentence, also goes on to say; ".... however, any ensuing loss to property described in Cov A and B not excluded or excepted in this policy is covered".
Therefore, as an interior ceiling, wall or floor is not excluded property under Cov A, and if any of that had an ensuing loss from the opening post scenario; it would be covered damage.
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< Message edited by CCarr -- 6/23/2004 8:24:39 PM >
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RE: Shingles not installed properly - 6/23/2004 8:08:43 PM
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KileAnderson
Posts: 199
Joined: 4/19/2004
Home base: Baton Rouge, LA
Status: offline
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The shingles wouldn't be covered but the water damage inside would be. It's just like wind driven rain, there is no opening but the water got in so there is coverage. If the insured left the window open and in rained inside there would be coverage. We had a claim come into the office last week. We paid to replace the roof due to hail last year. Mr. Insured thought he'd save a buck and do it himself. He tears it off and it gets dark so he figures he'll finish tomorrow. 3 a.m. the rain starts. Lots of ceiling damage occurs. It is still a covered loss. It is a seperate loss from the hail claim, but it is still covered.
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