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fivedaily

USA
258 Posts

Posted - 03/10/2004 :  23:30:37  Show Profile
I have a unique claim on Long Island.

Cedar board walls have water damage at bottom that can't be sanded out or covered. PA and I have agreed to replace the damaged boards (~865 sf).

The disagreement comes to pricing the boards. They are ~3.5 inches wide, tongue and groove, with knots(but no holes). I called the nearby Home Depot and they sell 14 sf contractor packs for ~$20.00. I think this is a comparable product based on the info given to my by HD, though I haven't seen it. My total cost per sf is ~$3.63. PA is asking for ~$40.00 per sf.

I am having a very hard time reconciling the differences here. He suggests that the walls are "antique cedar barnboard." I can't find a local supplier who sells an item with this name.

I would like to know how each of you would resolve this price difference. There is no disagreement on scope, just price on the cedar.

I plan to call the local office in the morning to see what they say about the pricing, but would like to hear any other suggestions you may have based on your experience in Long Island or with the type of wall covering I have described.

Jennifer

LarryW

USA
126 Posts

Posted - 03/11/2004 :  00:02:41  Show Profile
Jenn, Water stains on cedar can be acid washed out. I think the process involves muriatic acid, if I am not mistaken. As far as the price difference, I am sure there are tons of web-sites where you could look up specialty lumber to get a valid quote for material pricing. Or you could contact a reliable G.C. and get a realistic unit price quote. As always, the more information you can provide, the more reliable the quote you will get.

Antique cedar barnboard huh? I bet.

Good Luck

Larry Wright
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Catmandale

USA
67 Posts

Posted - 03/11/2004 :  02:08:36  Show Profile
Jennifer,

My take is that the PA is trying to sell you on the idea that the home was decorated with salvaged barn boards for a rustic appearance, and that as "antique" materials they have an increased value. Does he have knowledge of who installed the material and when?

I would be very suprised to find this kind of antique material done as a T&G material. Old barn boards would, to my thinking, be laid up as straightedged, butt boards to achieve the rustic appearance.

Is the cedar laid vertical or horizontal? Smooth, roughsawn or distressed? What is the thickness and edge detail? What type of water damage do you have?

Home Depot though, may not be the best source of finding this material...I would recommend a good local contractor and his reputable lumber supplier.

Good luck
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trader

USA
236 Posts

Posted - 03/11/2004 :  08:40:43  Show Profile
I would ask the best paint contractor in the county to treat the whole area and bring the finish back to as near to "before" as possible. This is what the PA and his contractor will do with the $36.00 sf disputed amount.
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ChuckDeaton

USA
373 Posts

Posted - 03/11/2004 :  12:38:42  Show Profile
If they are truly "antique cedar barn boards" they are rough sawn, cut with a circle saw, 4 quarter lumber, that is to say full dimensional boards and they are not tongue and groove. However they have the same appearance front and back. There would be nothing wrong with pulling the boards off the wall, just take a nail set and drive the finish nails thru, then turn the board over and flip them end for end. Now any discoloration is on the back of the board and is at the top. Install a base and crown molding and the will look just as it did before the water damage.

I just bought some 4 quarter rough sawn red cedar from Home Depot.

Cedar Siding
"Surfaced 1 Side 2 Edges Cedar Board"
__________________________________________________________________________

"Craft@Hrs","Unit","Material","Labor","Total"
__________________________________________________________________________

"Surfaced 1 Side 2 Edges Cedar Board"
"Nominal sizes. Actual thickness is about 3/4 . Actual width is about 1/2 less than the nominal width."
__________________________________________________________________________

SKU 161895, 3/4" x 2" x 8' --@.000 Ea 2.95 -- 2.95

SKU 161897, 3/4" x 4" x 8' --@.000 Ea 4.50 -- 4.50

SKU 161901, 3/4" x 4" x 12' --@.000 Ea 7.80 -- 7.80

SKU 161925, 3/4" x 6" x 8' --@.000 Ea 8.95 -- 8.95

SKU 727626, 3/4" x 6" x 12' --@.000 Ea 11.90 -- 11.90



There are thousands of board feet of antique barn boards in Arkansas and if you really need it I can scource you some and ship them to the contractor. 4 quarter cedar, rough cut with a circle saw is common in this area. It would be western red cedar.
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fivedaily

USA
258 Posts

Posted - 03/11/2004 :  14:27:57  Show Profile
Thanks for all the helpful replies. Along Chuck's train of thought, these did come from old barns torn down in upstate NY. When I called the PA this am to make one more effort to get an agreed price we finally got many details ironed out as to how they came to their total and what I would be willing to pay. I think we are going to get a signed Proof of Loss in a week or so.

I would have loved to just turn the boards around, but the circumstances of the loss don't make that possible. The insured was not home when the pipe burst, so the walls sat in a few inches of water for maybe a week. The water wicked up over the 4" cedar base the entire thickness of the board making flipping the board not possible.

And... if the insured has their contractor flip the board, it should be noted on the estimate they send us and will lessen the amount of depreciation they can recover.

Thanks for the help!

Jennifer
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ChuckDeaton

USA
373 Posts

Posted - 03/11/2004 :  16:08:58  Show Profile
Five, I did a little research, reading this will help your understanding of lumber. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3801911120&category=41502
A mill at Pine Ridge, Arkansas has dry western red ceder for sale. It is mill run, 4 quarter lumber FOB Pine Ridge.

Before it could be used it would have to be picked up from the mill, rip sawn, sanded, milled and shipped to Long Island.

The mill price is $1800 for 3100 board feet or about 61 cents per board foot plus sales tax at the mill.
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Catmandale

USA
67 Posts

Posted - 03/12/2004 :  01:13:33  Show Profile
Jennifer,

You could always take those valuable,precious antique barn boards as salvage and have them reworked and sold for use elsewhere.

Its already been recycled once.

You may even recover enough to return the Insureds deductible.[:D]


Edited by - Catmandale on 03/12/2004 01:16:12
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fivedaily

USA
258 Posts

Posted - 03/12/2004 :  15:44:32  Show Profile
Dale... I have found on cat work that the idea of collecting salvage is limited to generators and mobile homes.

Jennifer
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trader

USA
236 Posts

Posted - 03/12/2004 :  17:52:28  Show Profile
Always sell it back to the Insured on Homeowner losses, if you can. Write it in the estimate as a negative amount and be finished for good, or call a salvor. Keep it easy and simple, enjoy life.
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Catmandale

USA
67 Posts

Posted - 03/13/2004 :  13:27:38  Show Profile
Jennifer,

I agree regarding salvage on a cat operation, my comment was meant as sarcasm toward the PA's overvaluation of the material.

However, could it possibly be passed back to the line unit for handling, if you wanted to address the issue?

Dale
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fivedaily

USA
258 Posts

Posted - 03/14/2004 :  14:56:19  Show Profile
Dale, that is typically how salvage is handled from my experience. I either offer to sell it to the insured on the spot (getting verbal auth from my manager) or send it into the local office to address if they care to.

Jennifer

Edited by - fivedaily on 03/16/2004 06:52:32
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