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CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
 Posted - 04/21/2003 : 13:29:39
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Darryl, I had to read Lenny's (LAW1526) post again and absorb it further. It just seems to me that Lenny is everything a vendor is looking for. I know for a fact that his commentary is played out in real life as he describes his experiences.
How many Lenny's do you have in your deployed stable? Seems to me that you would require a high ratio of Lenny's type, to offset the "robo-adjuster". Yes, no? |
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Darryl
USA
36 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 14:55:23
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First, when you mention the types of roofs mentioned by others, I didn't read any of the posts that referred to the types of roofs in Pineville, only Dallas.
This is why at times I hesitate to respond to posts. My comments about the tons of claims was tongue in cheek. I just meant that in a perfect world you want the best customer service with the most claims possible closed and the least amount reopened. I am not involved with the deployment of adjusters for our Company but I am amazed by the job done by the individual that is. It is a thankless position. I have been privy to his decision making in the past and it it very subjective. I don't know how it can be anything but! Sometimes a better adjuster is passed over because of loyalty to an adjuster that has worked exclusively for us, othertimes a newer adjuster is selected over an adjuster that has been with us for some time as we have to keep the infusion of new blood in the business. There is no magic formula and our attempts to select the right adjuster for the right job is no better nor no worse than anyone else. We take it quite seriously, the fact that evertime we make a selection we are affecting an individual's livlihood.
As far as my last paragraph suggesting that I didn't want "robo-adjusters" putting their numbers on the board, first I assume that by the board you mean CADO. I don't see any useful benefit for putting that number out on the forum. Any carrier that wants to know that number has only to look at the closing information he receives from our sites.
Once again as to the numbers quoted for the environment described, those numbers were in Pineville, not Dallas and without having examined the facts of the Pineville storm I can't objectively say whether the numbers mentioned were good, exceptional, average or anything else and find it difficult to understand how anyone else can. As all seasoned adjusters know each storm and site is an animal unto itself.
Concerning Lenny's comments, on their face I agree that one Lenny is worth many "rip & runners". This in no way is meant to imply that Shorty is a "rip & runner". Without examining the site information and the number of reopens, if any I'm not qualified to make that judgment. When I did manage storm sites, it was a well known fact that I did not take kindly to "rip & run" adjusters and did not want them working for me.
Pragmatically speaking though, on a large storm you need some of each. We have to remember that as vendor we dance to the tune of the carrier. If they want numbers, you give them numbers with the best quality you can. If they want perfection, you give them perfection with the best numbers you can.
Once again my hat is off to the person that has to make the staffing decisions for any vendor. It is a thankless job.
Forgive my rambling but I've had better days.
Darryl |
Edited by - Darryl on 04/21/2003 15:00:10 |
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CatDaddy
USA
310 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 14:59:36
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I agree with you concerning numbers CC. I know adjusters that do the NUMBERS and dont do the JOB. I am killing off the ones that DON'T one by one.
You and I and others have had similar postings concerning "high-volume" claim adjusters and the turn and burner types. Both are out there. They know who they are. Some need to be more humble but non-tha-less, they're there.
Why does a vendor give one claim rep more files than another? I would say cause that claim rep can handle it and maintain a high level of customer service and the other cannot. Who can say? But I sure dont think its time to start calling vendors and carriers on the carpet cuz none of you/us are in that type of position. Call your favorite/exclusive vendor and chew him out because they gave someone else more files than you and see if your phone ever rings again. This site is full of people wanting to break into this business and all they are waiting for is a chance to take your spot.
Who wants to open their big mouth next and give up their place in the big game? Newt is packed and ready to roll!
Clayton, please disregard the preceeding. I do not include you in my target audience for those comments. Also, I will kiss the ground the day I work/reinspect my last hail claim too! |
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CatDaddy
USA
310 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 16:07:38
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Well said Darryl. You do need some of both when it comes to "rip and runners" and "the bulls that walk down to see the cows."
Every cat site needs the steady "bulls" so to speak. They provide the foundation for every successful cat operation. Then there are the wild horses that run like the wind BUT stumble every now and then. Its their manager's job to tame them and teach them to produce quality files while running at top speed. If all they can do is run but not do the work of the bulls, its glue factory time!!! The vendor gets the call and all he hears on the other end is NEXT!
CD |
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CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 16:53:50
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Thanks Darryl, for your comments in reply.
I am still somewhat in the dark regarding the posting on the "board" of "robo-adjuster" numbers; whether they be on the board as Lenny describes or here on CADO. From a longevity perspective, the board that Lenny speaks of; seems self-defeating. Perhaps chalking up the numbers here on CADO by people, could be of benefit to some, especially knowing what vendor and carrier through which those efforts were achieved.
However, I think there are some other things we have learned today, that should be added to our plate of "know before you go". Much as a vendor dances to the tune of a carrier, as you so nicely described; the adjuster must know the lyrics to the vendor's song. In that regard, when deployment calls are received, adjusters should determine the synergy of the carrier / vendor as follows;
(a) Does the carrier want numbers?
If so, the emphasis is then on quantity.
If so, quality is not job #1.
(b) Does the carrier want perfection?
If so, the emphasis is then on quality
If so, quantity is not job #1.
I'm sure if adjusters asked these questions and got those answers, as part of there "know before you go" chat, the vendors would have just a wonderful group for each event.
Funny business this cat claims part of the insurance claim circle. It seems to work at odds with the economy of supply and deamnd.
A storm hits a certain area, and everything from lumber to generators are no longer on sale, and most times the prices are quickly inflated - supply and demand.
But, at the same time, vendors are trying to kick each other in the knee to nickel down the service costs for their engagement with a carrier to manage a stable of independent contractor adjusters. And, that assembled stable takes their cut from that pressured down price. During all this, adjusters line up at the gate wanting to join the herd. Quite odd? Someone else reminded me of this today, and I just pass it along in continued confusion of that economic model.
When the day comes that adjusters no longer cower in the corner, in fear of vendor reprisals if they dare ask too many questions; maybe they would get more respect as independent contractors.
All these people in line, as you mention Lannie, that are wanting to break into this business; should carefully examine their role as an independent contractor. An independent contractor must seek work, whether that be assignments or projects or whatever within their skill set. Yes, I/As "offer" their services, and they should market themselves as an I/A. However, that does not mean they should have to grovel and cow toe to a vendor, an entity that would be dead in the water without a suitable stable of I/As.
Oh my, look at me, I've rambled and have got off topic; sorry.
Time to hitch up the grain sack and take some nourishment; then watch the Leafs beat hell out of Philly - hockey eh? |
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Newt
USA
657 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 16:55:25
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I will know nothing about the time it takes to me close a claim, until I have experience in the field.
What I do know from my own study, hail, windstorm and flood are different and require different degrees of listing damages. Some contents coverages require a lot of research and different degrees of calculating depreciation. I got to learn how to do the estimating programs with more speed and without a bunch of errors.
So you guys doing ten plus a day, have no fear, I'll never get there. I admire your ability and know you have developed a system that permits that kind of production. I will deal with quality first. I do think the race for the most claims settled may intemidate some into trying to beat the clock. Some are not capable and in trying to best someone, they make mistakes. If this is expected of me, I can stay home. I only get satisfaction out of a quality product and in the end the income will be there, always has been for me.
Welcome back, Clayton, hope everything is going well. I was getting concerned with that SARS virus going around. Stay safe eh.
Darryl, I am going to email you soon, I need some advice on training. It sure was a pleasure meeting you guys at the convention and enjoyed the presentation.
Lenny, looks like you struck a medium, do your best and to heck with the rest. I can't see getting road rage in adjusting, if this has got to be a race let me off at the next stop.
There are a lot of reasons why some adjusters are faster, they have a system and stick to it. They work no harder than people like me who have doubts about their work and have to double check everything they do. |
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mshort68
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 18:51:39
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| Guys, I wasn't bragging, because I really could care less what you all think. I'm just excited about being in the business and running and gunning. I wish everyone the best and I'll put my work product against anyone. No hard feelings, there is plenty to go around. This will be my last post on this site so if you want to talk to me, I'll see you on the 10/12's. OUT!!!!! |
The grass is always greener on the other side, but it still has to be mowed! |
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Jim Lakes
USA
37 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 19:35:29
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TO ALL:
I really didn’t want to get into this fray but felt I just had to add a quick couple of comments.
1) Give me an adjuster like Lenny any day over one that “runs and guns.”
2) I have been in this business a long time and have for years had to straighten out their messes. All I have to say about that is “give me an adjuster that closes 12-15 a day and I will show you an adjuster that I will have to go back and re-do over half of them, not to mention the carrier raising hell.” BEEN THERE, DONE THAT.
Maybe we will stay poor all my life, but if we can’t produce the quality with the numbers then I will refuse the numbers.
Jim Lakes, RPA
VP Catastrophe Operations
RAC Catastrophe Services, Inc.
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Ghostbuster
476 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 20:15:33
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Here is how to do 20 files per day.
The Top Ten Rules for Quantity, Not Quality
First, there can be NO reinspections by the vendor or the carrier.
Second, there must be extremely little paperwork. No diagram, the log sheet entry must be limited to: Contacted, saw, & settled. No SOL's. No draft/check writing. No photos. Just a simple hand written estimate of no more than six entries.
Third, the storm must be straight down hail or wind with no rain.
Forth, no appointments and no dogs in the back yard or locked gates.
Fifth, no siding, screens, gutters, or anything else that would exceed the six line estimate rule. No interior or contents.
Sixth, all the losses must be VERY close to each other.
Seventh, going into the storm office daily is optional.
Eighth, all phone traffic must be shunted away from the storm office to eliminate office interference.
Ninth, grossly overpay every loss to keep the Insureds and contractors quiet.
Tenth, close em' fast, collect your money, and get out of town to the next storm before it all blows up in your face. |
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LAW1526
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 20:24:12
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To clear up the issue regarding the board. The board I was referring to, was placed on the wall in the storm office where we were all working out of, for all to see. I guess the board was placed there to motivate adjusters. The information posted on the board did motivate me to try harder.
During my past five years I have worked all types of storms and claims. I can keep up with the best of them and the volume for closing demand levied by the carriers. It generally requires 16 hours a day 7 days a week.
The point I was trying to make in my earlier post was to produce a quality product may take a little bit longer, but it only has to be done once. I felt and still do, if I can complete a reasonable amount of claims per day with out having to get them back for corrections and have them reopened after I’m gone then every body wins. I win because I did a good job, the IA companies win because they can trust my files with out spending a lot of time examining them before forwarding them to the carriers file examiner, the carrier wins because they received a completed claim worked and closed in a timely manner and most importantly their insured wins. I give the insured the attention they require, answer their question to the best of my knowledge and pay them for all the resulting damage we collectively agree on.
All in a days work.
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JimF
USA
1014 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 20:31:54
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Lenny (Law1526), every catastrophe vendor and storm manager who reads this Forum should be banging on your door trying to get you on their dedicated cat adjuster list, and sending you out and keeping you on storm assignments as much as you want to work.
You exemplify all that is good about this profession and you have set the standard for excellence by which every new and old adjuster should measure him or her self.
Good Luck.
Your future is Bright, Unlimited and Professional in every respect, in Cat Adjusting! |
Edited by - JimF on 04/21/2003 20:33:00 |
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Ghostbuster
476 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 20:37:44
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Now...to fine tune your Techniques-de-Incompetencia...
It goes without saying that you never climb a roof. All roofs are guessed at from the ground by reciting the magic words, " Yeahh, I was on a roof just like that one last year in Abilene and it was 33 1/3 squares!"
A tape measure is for ornamentation only.
If the Insured should happen to be home when you arrive, always keep a water pistol in a zip lock bag in your pocket so you can squirt a stain on the ceiling when he's not looking and thus run up the fee bill.
Never measure a fence, just count the sections and multiply by 10'. It's faster that way than trying to multiply by the correct distance of each span.
Never stay at the same motel as any of the rest of the crew. Be invisible. The less your face is seen, the less you can be remembered.
If damaged screens and dryer vents are an issue on the storm, always include seven screens on every estimate, whether there are any screens or not. But, never write any more than one dryer vent per house. That would be too obvious.
There are lots of other nasty little tricks of the trade, see if you can make up some new ones along the way. |
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Catmannn
42 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2003 : 22:08:38
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CRAP
MY 14 YEARS IN THIS BUSINESS, I STILL HAVE NOT LEARNED HOW TO CALL AND TALK TO 224 INSUREDS IN A WEEK, MUCH LESS SET UP FILES, PREPARED PAPERWORK, I KNOW I CAN'T DRAW AND MEASURE 224 HOMES IN 24 DAYS, HELL I CAN'T EVEN FIND 224 HOMES IN A WEEK. THE BUBA MUST HAVE A REAL GOOD PLAN. WRITE A BOOK, SO AMAZON CAN SELL IT IN THE FICTION SECTION!!!! |
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Newt
USA
657 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2003 : 00:17:59
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The adjusters I talked to at the convention were of the same mindset as Lenny. I think that says a lot for the majority. There are those who do more and to their credit, they may be faster.
I know how I work and I tend to put a lot of time making sure the customer is satisfied or at least understands what my limitations are. Thats any kind of service.
In this field I will have more people to please. Before it was just the customer and myself, most times it was harder to please myself than it was the client.
I'll never apologize for taking my time but I will for mistakes. The only way to prevent mistakes is don't do anything. I will make some I am sure, not because of sloppy work but because of ignorance. I am working on that.
I don't talk about any ones accomplishments. If they are proud of what they can do, more power to them. My benchmark is not in how many, it is in zero defects and be on time. |
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CatDaddy
USA
310 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2003 : 09:11:06
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Well...looks like you guys ran poor Shorty off. Congratulations. You cant do it so it must be a lie. I am preparing a private send to Admin and request we rename the site NCADO.
Narrow-minded Cat Adjusters.org.
There's alot of intelligence running thru this site but sadly alot of stupidity too. This is an excellent place to learn about the business but so many of you start squealing when you hear something you cannot understand or do yourselves. We all know people that work the way you've explained as the "run and gunners" and I am sure some of you are describing yourselves. I dont like them any more than you, in fact, its my job to weed them out. Believe what you want about Shorty. Call him what you want. Big mouth? He has the biggest. Good cat adjuster? One of the fastest and most thorough you'll ever run across. He'll be laughing at you all from his mansion on the hill one day. Maybe you can get a job cutting his grass. It pays more than what most of you seem to be doing right now.
See some of you in Dallas in about a month. Look me up if you go to work for Big Red. Later!
CD
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It started on Hail and ended where ??
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